Loading ...The fourth and final preseason game is pretty much as bad as it gets: the starters hardly play, while they do you're just praying they don't get hurt and the looming season opener (the following Wednesday, September 5th against the Dallas Cowboys, in case you forgot) combine to make the entire silly exercise even more excruciating.
But that doesn't mean we take a break around here at G101. No coasting into the regular season. Here's what we're watching for against Tom Brady and the New England Patriots.
The defensive tackles
With Chris Canty officially on the shelf until the 6th week of the season, there's only two sure things for Big Blue at defensive tackle: starter Linval Joseph and presumed fellow starter Rocky Bernard. After that, you've got four guys fighting for two, or maybe three, spots: Marvin (I haven't played a meaningful snap in years and I just hurt my back again) Austin, Marcus (I thought my career was over a few weeks ago when no one showed free agent interest in me) Thomas, Markus (the German 7th-round prospect) Kuhn and Dwayne (I've been on the team for two years but you've never heard of me) Hendricks.
All of these guys give reason to think they can contribute. And all come with question marks, from health to readiness to talent. We're sure the Giants have an idea which way they're leaning, but with the starters playing only a drive or two there should be plenty of playing time against the Patriots. Last chance to open some eyes for some big guys up front.
The Giants came into the season stacked at cornerback. And now Michael Coe is lined up to start the season opener. Let's put it this way: if Coe gets exposed by the Patriots starters (or, we suppose, even worse, the backups) people are going to melt down. It's unlikely the Giants will push turf toe-stricken rookie Jayron Hosley in this meaningless game, so all eyes will be on Coe and fellow bottom-of-the-depth-chart-guy-turned-possible-starter Justin Tryon.
Reinforcements
Speaking of Michael Coe and Justin Tryon starting, it's easy to wonder whether Jerry Reese has secondary help on the radar. Even if guys start to get healthy, there's really almost zero experience in the cornerback unit behind Corey Webster. Whether it's Deon Grant, a veteran corner who gets cut (or the Giants trade for) or a waiver claim, don't be too surprised to be watching a guy who's not currently on the team getting some crash-course reps against the Patriots.
By all accounts, it looks like Chase Blackburn will retain the early down middle linebacker duties despite Herzlich generating buzz earlier in the summer. If that's the case, this could be the last opportunity for Herz to show that he's coming on strong as an NFL. Believe us, a standout performance even with the second team this week and people will be penciling him in as the 2013 starter.
Sean Locklear
With David Diehl getting older and William Beatty still unable to get on the field, swing tackle Sean Locklear looks like he might get his number called. We kept an eye on him last week and were pleasantly surprised. Another performance like that from the veteran Locklear is good news for Eli Manning and the running game.
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The ironic thing about the 4th preseason game is there are some players you rather not play well. Guys like Douglas, Ojomo, Muasau, Mccants, etc. that you want to put on your PS may force your hand if they have that “Cruz” type breakout performance.
I think the end of the roster questions come down do you keep the best players or solify depth a certain positions. I think OL is the spot that we could go with only 8 players not because that’s ideal depth but because or depth choices are worse players than who we could keep at another position.
Beatty is questionable health wise, Boothe has never started a full season, Snee had health issues last year which could mean he’s breaking down and Bass had injury issues last year as well. So can we afford to keep only 8? It depends on how the team feels about Lockear or even Brewer at guard. If they are realistic options then that could mean Petrus is toast. I doubt we want to move Diehl back inside becasue that’s changing 2 positions. If Beatty can start it could allow Lockear to be the Boothe of the past and basically the top backup everywhere except center. I have seen Lockear lsited as a guard so he has done it before I just wonder if we see him as being able to play guard as well as Petrus.
I think Paysinger better than Jones but Jones has more roster value. Paysinger I feel is very close to a lock and keeping 8 LBs is still possible. This could be the position Sash takes when he returns. But that would give addition time to make a decision.
3 RBs is not crazy but I think it doesn’t fit our team. we have a #1 RB who’s a big health risk. A #2 RB who’s a rookie and we don’t complete trust in pass protection. A #3 RB who’s solid all around but no one trusts as the #1 if called upon. A #4 who is explosive and some running talent but the rookie is better in those areas and the #4 is still questionable in pass protection. A #5 who’s like #3 but isn’t proven and as trusted by the coaches as #3. I don’t see with all the flaws how we could keep just 3 RBs. I think 4 RBs allows us to cover for the flaws our RB group has with each player.
Too late. Everyone already knows about Ojomo (you don’t get three sacks in the preseason without teams noticing). And I suspect that most teams know about Douglas but won’t want him. He has looked good but hasn’t jumped off the screen like Cruz did against the Jets.
The two whom I would rather see stay on the bench tonight are Muasau and McCants. I would not want either to flash because they are ticketed for the practice team and I think they both may have high upsides. At the very least, I’d like them held out until mop-up time so scouts can’t tell how they’d do against guys higher up on the Pats’ depth chart.
Ojomo has played againt backups. A team might not feel he’s worth a roster spot becasue he’s unproven. A team could sign him but remember many teams have players like Ojomo. The Eagles are going to have to cut or trade a proven player like Tapp.
McCants I think is not as easy to get to the PS as some think. LTs are of high value in the NFL so even a raw one has value.
Guys, it’s very simple. Some of you are getting lost in Potentialand, where your mind becomes intoxicated by the ruby-eyed evaluations of some bloviators on the Internet and fantasizes about what could be.
None of the following will make the final cut–Mussau (sorry Krow), Stanback (sorry FF55), White, Cordle, Jones, Ojomo, Douglas and Scott. It’s not that these guys are bad, or might not otherwise be possibilities under other circumstances. No, the issue here, once you’ve departed Potentialand, is cold, unforgiving reality. And let’s reassess reality for those who might have forgotten a few key points:
1) Jerry Reese ain’t cutting a high draft pick less than 4 years into his NFL career. Thus, we can make valid arguments why Barden or Jernigan *should* be cut, but that’s just theoretical. They’re on this team, and will be expected to contribute.
2) Hicon is one of Coughlin’s guys. He’s also a talented player who can help us win games. He’s a vet, he knows the system and he’s valuable on specials. His ticket is punched.
That brings us to 6 WR. In other years, perhaps carrying a 7th WR would be possible or even wise. But this year is not like other years because:
3) We have serious injury and depth concerns at CB and DT. We have to keep roster spots open for Thomas and Austin, players who you don’t know if they’re going to be real contributors. At DT, we PUP’d Canty, so that frees up a roster spot, but the reality is that the DL, like the WR spot, is stacked with sure things and we aren’t going to waste a roster spot on “could be’s” when we have so many “are’s.” This means that we will not be stockpiling DTs, when we never have more than 3 active on game day. The only spot open on the DL is the Tollefson role. And from the looks of it, Tracy has that locked up.
4) Greg Jones sucks. Period. He’s garbage. Could he find employment elsewhere? Sure. The Eagles fielded an entire squad of undersized and undertalented LBs last year. But on this team, he is not going to be the 3rd guy on the MLB depth chart, and he ain’t good enough to be the 4th guy on the SAM depth chart. He’s gone.
Can’t really disagree with any of that. The only one of those who I think has a decent chance of making it is Cordle, given all the bad reviews Petrus has garnered this preseason.
kujo
much of what you say I agree with, but I think it is a bit overstated
over the last couple of years Reese has released draft picks such as sintim and dillard — Dillard never really flashed and young blood came in right behind him
Sintim never flashed and had back to back injuries
I use these as examples because while the early releases are uncommon, they are not unheard of; it depends in part on what else is in the stable
while I agree draft staus and age should make Jernigan safe, there is no arguing that Douglas has looked better this summer as a receiver and returner and TC seems to like him
I continue to believe we all over-value Hixon
If he were cut tomorrow he would likely go unsigned anywhere else
but the real issue is CB and DT which is really complicating things with all the walking wounded
The Jets would sign Hixon the second he hits the waiver wire. The Dolphins would too. I suspect there are plenty of other teams that would do so, but I’m not familiar enough with them to know what their situation is with wide receivers and kick returners.
Just remember, while Randle is getting his feet wet Hixon will prove a very reliable #3 wide receiver who regularly beats #3 corners and any safety. He also gets consistently to where Eli expects him to go and makes great reads in his pattern. Barden is too slow off the LOS to do that job as well. Jernigan has shown nada to date. Hixon is on this roster.
Dead on. Your night out is sharpening your wit. Soon you’ll be as smart as I.
Dillard was a 5th round pick. Sintim had 2 ACLs and microfracture surgery.
I don’t expect Stanback to make it. But I definitely like him. He should be in the NFL somewhere. Douglas isn’t making this roster unless he clearly outplays Jernigan tonight and the coaches get fed up with an undersized guy who may start reminding them of Sinorice Moss. Barden is safe.
I sure hope it’s Jones who gets cut. I think it should be, I think it will be. But I’m not counting my chickens before they hatch. I think Paysinger is a lot more than a “nice” player. he could be challenging for a starter’s job on some teams and he will probably be #3 or #4 on next year’s depth chart at OLB, especially if they cannot sign Osi and Kiwi is moved back to DE.
I’ve been all about saying we’re in “win now” mode, so I agree with you that younger players are fighting a real uphill battle. Potential ain’t gonna cut it. We will jettison some good ballplayers and some with terrific potential. So be it. We’re shooting for a repeat championship and a lot of veterans like Chase Blackburn may not be as good athletes as some but know how to play, and win.
In using you words I think Cordle would make the roster over Petrus. Petrus’ advantage is potential not his current play. Plus Cordle is versatile with the ability to play center.
Scott. Right now is a more useful player than Brown. He’s a good special team s player and can return kicks. His speed can be used on outside runs or quick hitting plays. That’s a player that can help us win today.
I do agree with #1-3. Concerning #4 while Jones might be gone, you are using you opinion instead of what TC/JR will do against your own advice. Jones is 3rd team MLB and 2nd team SLB on the depth chart. That gives him a shot at making the team.
I don’t think Coe is a player we should watch because I don’t think he should play much. He’s our #2 CB right now. We know what Coe can do already. He’s already on this team and not much he can do by playing long tonight. Tryon might even be given a light load. Because we need to make sure we have healthy CBs for Dallas.
If I’m the Giants coaches I would not give up on Petrus. I have seen him pancake some very good defensive tackles (including BJ Raji last season in the game in MetLife). He is a VERY good run-blocker who seems not to have yet figured out pass protection.
So let’s say that Eli and this offense jells and they can get a lot of early leads instead of having to consistently cause their fans to have heart palpitations in the 4th quarter as they try to pull out games. With 10-point leads the Giants will want to emphasize the running game. Petrus looks to me like the kind of kid who can literally wear down and discourage his opponent if we run consistently to his side. That has value as long as Flaherty believes that Petrus will eventually get better at reading the defense and picking up his assignments against pass-rushers. The kid is very strong. He should be capable of protecting the pocket once he knows what he’s doing. And in his case I think he’ll need more time to learn what he needs to do simply because he does not appear to be the sharpest knife in the drawer.
Jones goes against the NFL trend of faster LBs who can cover. Nor is he a blitzer who can generate pressure. He was born a generation too late, and that’s going toget him cut.
Think Zach Thomas, but less talented.
I’m going tonight, but not sure how long I’ll stay. Anything other than the obvious that anyone wants me to “scout” tonight? Keep it to those who will be playing until about half-way through the third quarter. I won’t be there much longer than that.
Sean Locklear. Guy might be protecting Eli’s blind side for a while.
On the defense, defensive tackles and Michael Coe.
Robinson– How is his blocking coming along? He won’t see the field until that part of his game is steady and reliable. I’m not down on Pascoe like some on here, but I’d much rather see Bennett and Robinson on 2 TE sets. From what you see tonight, are we gonna see much or any of that?
Barden- My father has been extolling his blocking on the perimeter. Is he seeing something I’m not?
Kujo — Nice rant. Mostly right. A few bones to pick:
David Douglas. The kid didn’t return all the punts in the 3rd preseason game for no reason. Was he keeping that seat warm for Hosley? Maybe, maybe not. In a year where there’s not a lot of contribution on ST from the WR depth (as if there ever is) I wouldn’t be too shocked to see them keep seven WRs if they think Douglas can contribute fully on ST.
You’re right that Hixon’s not going anywhere, but why are we talking about holding a roster spot for Marvin Austin like it’s a sure thing? The guy hasn’t played meaningful football in years, his back is acting up and there’s already the Canty thing going on at the position. If I think Kuhn or Hendricks are ready to contribute in the rotation now, I’d rather have one of them and IR Austin.
Re: Austin
Because Reese has not released a 2nd year player who he drafted above the 4th round (Sintim being the only player outright released from the top 4 rounds of a Reese-led draft). Sure there’s a case you can make for releasing him. And if Canty was healthy, I bet that case would have even more weight to it. But THIS year, with the realities facing THIS team, and THIS GM running the show, he’s not going anywhere, particularly if they think he could contribute late in the season.
Re: Douglas
As I said, there’s nothing saying that some of these guys aren’t worth consideration. But at WR, it’s a numbers thing. Are they going to go with 7 WRs with the choices we face at LB, CB and DT? Think about it this way–would you want another body at WR who would be 7th on that depth chart, and lost behind the 2-4 guys who will be competing for the KR/PR reps? I’d love to have him on the practice squad as a development guy. But I’m taking an extra LB or CB who can really contribute on kick coverage.
UUT
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