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Loading ...The knowledgeable fans on this site are familiar with the players expected to be drafted in the early rounds of the NFL Draft. However, where NFL GMs make decisions that keep their jobs down the road are finding solid players with their mid-late round picks. These are some of the hidden gems on the offensive side of the ball in the 2010 NFL Draft, players I expect to go in the mid-late rounds that could be steals in the future. Defensive sleepers coming next week.
- QB – Levi Brown, Troy - As we all know by now this is a weak quarterback class. All of the talk about Sam Bradford, Jimmy Claussen and of course Tim Tebow. Let me go on record as saying Levi Brown is as good as a developmental QB as I have seen in the last few drafts. For a team with an established starter, he would be a great pick in the 5th round. Has the size (6′4 229lbs), Athletic (4.93 40 yard dash), strong arm, great leader who may have been the best with the media at the combine. He has a little Tony Romo to him. He has problems with consistent accuracy and reading defenses right now, but he can learn that with a few years of seasoning. I think he will be at worst a very good NFL backup in a few years.
- QB – Josh Skelton, Fordham - A hot name right now that is getting a little too much buzz is Skelton, a 6′6 243lb rocket armed quarterback out of Fordham. Skelton ran a great 40 (4.85) but is nowhere as athletic as Levi Brown on the field of play. I could see him coming off the board as early as the 5th round for a team that needs a developmental QB, because he can do one thing great, through the ball a mile.
- QB – Jarrett Brown, West Virginia - We had Pat White as the wildcat QB out of West Virginia who was over-drafted last season, and Jarrett Brown will do the same thing this season. Brown is not as athletic as White was, but it a better pure quarterback. He has better size (6′3 224lbs) and a better arm than White did a season ago. More of a quarterback coming out than White was and ran a 4.50 40 yard dash. Probably a 5th round pick.
- RB – James Starks, Buffalo - A shoulder injury cost Starks his 2009 season and dropped his stock. Starks has a nice combination of size (6′2 218lbs) and speed (4.50), and his college stats read like this: 2007 – 1103 yards, 12 TDs rushing 41 catches for 311 yards and 2 TDs receiving and 2008 – 1333 yards 16 TDs rushing and 52 catches 361 yards 1 TD). I think he would be a steal in the 5th round, and is the kind of upside pick Jerry Reese always nails.
- RB – Anthony Dixon, Mississippi State - A big back (6′1 233lbs) who struggled at the combine (4.67 40 yard dash), Dixon would be a nice fit for a team like the Chargers that needs a bruising tailback. He knows how to run downhill and was very productive in the SEC, gaining 1391 yards and scoring 12 TDs as a senior. Over his career at Miss State, carried 910 times for 3994 yards and scored a whopping 42 TDs (10.5 per year average). Also is solid in blitz pickup and a good receiver. Probably a 4th round pick.
- RB – Lonyae Miller, Fresno State - Although his backfield-mate Ryan Matthews is getting all of the press right now, Miller also turned some heads at the combine. He was nowhere near as productive as Matthews at Fresno, but did average 5.2 yards per carry as a senior. He has good size (6′ 221lbs) and ran in the low 4.4s at the combine. The tools are there, but the production was not because he just did not get the ball in 2009. He could be a steal in the 6th round.
- WR – Chris McGaha, Arizona State - The best route runner in the draft with fantastic hands, McGaha is one of my favorite sleepers in the 2010 draft. He is not a threat to score a lot of touchdowns, but he will get open and catch a ton of balls in the pros. He was faster than expected at the combine (4.51) and has good enough size (6′1 200lbs). He could be a steal in the 5th round.
- WR – Carlton Mitchell, South Florida - Great size (6′3 215lbs) and speed (4.46) combo. Mitchell intended to stay at USF, but left when Head Coach Jim Leavitt was fired. He was not extremely productive in college (only 105 catches for 1648 yards and 9 TDs over three seasons) but all of the tools are there. I bet he is a third round pick based on his physical skills alone.
- WR – Andre Roberts, Citadel - A small (5′11 195lbs) and speedy (4.40) receiver who was extremely productive in college (286 catches for 3743 yards and 36 TDs over four seasons. Compare those numbers to Mitchell, who will likely be drafted ahead of him in April. Over the last three seasons, Roberts caught 78, 95 and 77 passes respectively and looks like a steal in the 3rd-4th round.
- WR – Freddie Barnes, Bowling Green - This man set an NCAA record by catching 155 passes LAST SEASON. His numbers for 2009 – 155 receptions, 1770 yards, 19 TDs. His career was nowhere near as good, with totals of 298 catches 3,299 yards and 30 TDs, so the bulk of his production came in 2009. He did not measure (6′ 212lbs) or run (4.65) well at all, but he has to be doing something right. Could be a nice pick in the 5th or 6th round.
- WR – Marcus Easley, UConn - Another player who has consistently been on the rise due to a size (6′3 210lbs) and speed (4.39) combo. A former walk-on, Easley did not see the field as a freshman and caught a combined 5 passes for 104 yards as a sophomore and junior combined. He burst onto the scene as a senior, catching 43 passes for 893 yards and 8 touchdowns, then had a great combine. So he is a one year wonder, but the size and the speed is there, and someone could find themselves a nice steal in the 5th round.
- TE – Andrew Quarless, Penn State - A nice all around tight end, he has the combo of size (6′5 254lbs) speed (a surprising 4.68) and production (41 receptions for 583 yards and 3 TDs in 2009) that teams will look for in a second tight end. Very good blocker too and could be a nice player in the red zone due to his deceptive athleticism. Probably a 4th-5th round pick in a deep tight end class.
- TE – Colin Peek, Alabama - The tight end of the National Champion Crimson Tide, Peek is never going to be starting in the NFL, but he is the kind of player that every team has. A big (6′5 253lb) tight end, who is an excellent blocker, and always sneaks a few touchdowns a year in goal line packages. He will probably be an 8-year pro when all is said and done as a second or third tight end and a 6th round pick.
- TE – Jimmy Graham, Miami - Probably a name that anyone following this draft should know by now, the former basketball player is a freakish athlete at 6′6 260lbs. He only played one season of college football and only caught 17 passes for 213 yards and 5 TDs as a Red Zone target for the most part. One of those players that jumps out at workouts (4.54 40 yard dash, 38.5″ vertical) and coaches think they can mold him into the next Antonio Gates. This alone makes him a 3rd rounder.
- OT – Kyle Calloway, Iowa - A sleeper that I really like, Calloway has great size (6′7 323 lbs) and will be a starting right tackle in the NFL before long. A battle tested player, he is a great run blocker should be a long time NFL player who will be off the board late round 3 or early round 4.
- OT – Sam Young, Notre Dame - Once the top offensive line prospect in the country, Young never put it together and became a dominant collegiate tackle. He has slow feet, is not aggressive enough and plays too high. He has great size (6′8 316lbs) and is strong enough that with the right coaching he could become a starting right tackle one day, and could be a steal in the 6th round.
- OT – Jared Veldheer, Hillsdale - A player currently on the rise, Veldheer has great size 6′8 312lbs and athleticism for his build. He is a project who needs to add some strength to his towering frame, and he is probably at least a year away from having an impact on the field, but he is going to be a steal for someone in the 3rd round.
- OG – Marshall Newhouse, TCU - One prospect that is flying way under the radar and who will be a steal, Newhouse is 6′4 319lbs and has great athleticism, running a 4.99 40 yard dash while getting 25 reps on the bench. I see him as a long time starter in this league, who is likely a 4th round pick.
- OG – Zane Beadles, Utah - Another guard who could be a steal in the 4th-5th round, Beadles is 6′5 310lbs and could play a little tackle in the NFL. He has quick feet and a lean frame, which he could easily pack some more weight on. Some scouts believe he can also play tackle, even on the left side, down the road.
- OG – Mitch Petrus, Arkansas - Benched 225lbs 45 times at the combine and measured in at 6′3 310lbs on top of being a pretty good player, Petrus is a 5th rounder who could crack the starting lineup quickly in the NFL after facing tough competition in the SEC.
- OC – J.D. Walton, Baylor - My favorite center after Markuice Pouncey in this draft, Walton is tough as nails at 6′3 300lbs and could play guard if needed. He is a leader who plays with a mean streak and will likely be a starter within a year. He will be off the board in the 4th round area. I like him a little more than Matt Tennant, but he will be drafted after him.
- OC – Ted Larsen, NC State - A player gaining momentum right now, Larsen has good size at 6′3 305lbs and plenty of athleticism and strength. Probably a 6th rounder who will stick on an NFL roster.
As a Notre Dame fan I would really be upset if we picked Sam Young. I was so excited when he commited to ND, but then he ended up sucking hard for 4 years. He has one thing going for him, size. And thats pretty much it…
ROCm what do you think of Emmanuel Sanders from SMU? I really like him as a returnman…
Yeah, I like Sanders too. Strictly a return man…but he could be a good one. Reminds me of Michael Lewis who used to play for the Saints.
As a general rule… I feel the 6th and 7th round selections should give serious consideration to ’small school’ players or ones with ‘issues’… who often have big ‘upsides’.
It’s not often that these picks pan out anyway. This is the time to roll the dice. Very little to lose.
LaMarcus Coker RB Hampton. Dicey charachter, great talent. Lot of speed, good hands and can return kikcs. A guy I wouldnt mind taking a chance on late..
Calloway a sleeper? Even I, admittedly not an expert on college ball, have been touting him as a great third or fourth pick for the Giants for a long time. I think he is far from under the radar.
Yeah, there has been some talk about Calloway, but when you are projected as the 11th or 12th OT off the board I think you still need to be considered a sleeper.
Who is that OT that is a registered sex offender because he had sex with his sister when he was 15 or something like that? I read something on him and he looked pretty good, but it’s a pretty tough call on whether or not you’d want to bring somebody with that kind of baggage to the media capitol of the world.
And just to answer the question posed on Coughlin in the last thread if we should lose terribly or win the Superbowl again in 2010, then what? I would say replace him either way. Either cut our losses and move on because we have to, or let him ride into the sunset after having a Parcells-like run as the Giants coach.
However, if we are 11-5 and go 2-1 in the playoffs, what then? I say you almost have to bring him back.
Tony Washington, plays for Abilene Christian..
Tony Washington…hahaha, that was a crazy story.
Who is drafting this guy now? Who wants him in the locker room?
Shiiit Id still take him in the 4th-5th. It was a long time ago and it was consensual. Who knows, his sister might be really, really hot lol.
I would never want the guy in my locker room but I’ve heard a lot of teams really love this guy. Apparently not as much as his sister loved him but they do……LOL
Samard –
Not related to sleepers, but as a ND fan, what is your take on Golden Tate? First round or second round? Can he ever be a two or will he always be a slot? Will he have a problem with drops?
I keep moving him back and forth in my wideout rankings. I cannot decide who should be off the board first Tate or Benn. I think Benn has the higher ceiling, but Tate will not be a bust, while Benn could bust out.
Probably a second rounder when all is said and done? I think Thomas leapfrogs both of them on draft day, based on is size alone. Needs a TON of work.
I think Tate is a late 1st early second. He has the tools to be more then a slot receiver for sure. Runs very good routes, has elite timing and jumping ability. Has very good hands as well. His YAC abilities are among the best in this class imo, he is extremely hard to tackle. He is a converted RB so his vision is pretty legit. Only knocks on him are that he lets passes get into his body to much (But nohing like Benn does) and his size.
Kid is gonna make som plays though, for sure. He is also very good on ST and on trick plays (WC and stuff like that).
I have him as my 2nd WR. I actually have Damian Williams above Thomas and Benn as well. I think the latter two might go higher because of their ceiling, but Ive ranked them lower.
Also, Im not seeing this supposed 4.3 speed of Thomas, just not seeing it. Looks like Dwayne Jarret to me.
I am not seeing it when it comes to Thomas either.
He is huge, has giant hands and can run (I am not seeing the 4.3 either.) We know teams will overdraft him.
He is an AWFUL route runner (just runs the flag).
I agree with you on Damian Williams, he is going to be great. I see a lot of Steve Smith in him. Not the fastest or biggest guy but great hands, runs great routes, knows how to play the position and the game.
I am also a bigger fan of Mike Williams from Syracuse than most as a player…but his character concerns will kill him on D-Day.
I think Benn is going to be a star a couple years from now. However, I think Tate has the makings of being the next Steve Smith (ours) and the Jets should really think about targeting him at the bottom of the first round.
http://blog.al.com/press-register-sports/2010/01/tennessees_lamarcus_coker_has.html
Good read on Coker. Ran a 4.28 at the East Coast Bowl in Petersburg, Va., last month..
With a name like Coker you know Andy Reid is taking a hard look.
In fact… adoption is a possibility.
classic
http://www.sportsfanlive.com/sflreports/entry/sportsfanlive_com_exclusive_lineman_s
Tony Washington. So it was 7 years ago and he grew up in a “dysfuncional” family. Hes all Christian now lol, would fit right in here…
Still, rookies get hazed pretty bad as it is. How bad do you think Tony Washington’s would be? I mean, he didn’t just rob the cradle; he walked past mommy and daddy’s bed, climbed right into Sissy’s bassinet, and banged her from here to Deliverance Town!
Poor guy.
Whenever he made a mistake, he wouldn’t “screw the pooch”; he’d “bang his sister.”
ROC, Im a big fan of Williams as well. Or Im a big fan of his skillset. I dont like quitters. And if you look up quitter in the dicionary it has a picture of Mike Williams.. Still I have him 13th in my WR rankings, but would have been 6th most likely without his incidents..
Agree again. There is no doubt he is very talented and a dangerous threat every time he touches the ball. Too bad he quit on his team…bad idea when you are about to be making millions of dollars to play the sport.
Also HUGE Andre Roberts fan. Watched some tape, this kid is unbelieveable. Catches a TON of balls, gets open easily. Perfect slot receiver.
Kid from Citadel right? Havent seen him in-game, but caught him in the East-West game. Looks like a contributer. His physical skills will limit him though..
gman24,
Seriously, dude. I envy your optimism. I’m not a cynic, but you sure make me look like one.
1) You’d be better served to just forget about Andre Brown. Despite what he and the team are saying, dude is pretty much toast. It would take a medical miracle for him to be anything other than unemployed after training camp. BJ and Bradshaw have been injury-prone and who knows anything about Johnson and Ware. We need to address this area before it becomes the sequel to our Safetygeddon of last year.
2) Jon Goff is more athletic, younger and smarter than AP. In his limited time, he was playing behind the worst permutation of our defensive line of 2009. He was also playing next to Danny Clark, and in front of CC Brown, Michael Johnson and Aaron Rouse. In other words, can you really take anything away (positive or negative) from that sample set? It would be like a doctor taking blood from you to run tests, and, during that time, someone else’s blood gets mixed into yours. But he still extrapolates from the flawed sample and decides you have cancer. Thus, Jon Goff, in my view, deserves another year before he’s declared a “bust.” That’s not a knock against McClain or Spoon, that’s just my opinion.
I’ve seen Marcus Easley (UConn) live and he looked like a monster WR prospect. Dude looked like he should have been a top rated player going into the combine. When I asked my UConn friends about him and why I hadn’t heard of him they just laughed and said “Because none of us hear had heard of him before this season either.” I came home and did further research on him to find out he was basically unproductive his first 3 seasons (as stated above). Guys like that scare the hell out of me. I dont like one year wonders. However I can confirm that up close he looks like the real deal.
kujo-”It would take a medical miracle for him to be anything other than unemployed after training camp.” Why? Plenty of guys return from achilles injuries now a days. The surgeries have become much more advanced and the recovery rates are greatly increased from years passed. The only people I’ve ever heard say he’s done is users of this site. Almost every other report or rumor about him has been positive. Any reason behind your opinion?
Plenty of guys? Name some that are completely reliant on speed and a quick burst please.
http://www.emaxhealth.com/1275/2/35136/achilles-tendon-rupture-ends-many-nfl-careers.html
What Samardzija said.
Other comments on this article;
Kyle Calloway (Iowa) is a really good OT prospect.
Jared Veldheer (Hillsdale) is going to be an impact player in the NFL. He went to a small school but has big skills.
Colin Peek (Alabama) is one of my main TE targets in this draft. I really love his motor and blocking ability which is most important to me when targeting a TE for this team.My other two TE’s of interest are Anthony McCoy (USC) and Dorin Dickerson (Pittsburgh). I’m not really interested in any other TE prospects in this draft. To me there are bunch of receivers but very little blockers in this class. One of these three during the draft would make me very happy. IMO we need to strengthen our TE core. Didn’t like the Beckum pick at all.
But you like Dorin Dickerson? Am I the only one who finds this ironic? lol
I don’t like Dickerson at all.
Reminds me a lot of a much worse Dustin Keller. Great speed but really JUST a receiver. Some of these tight ends have a chance to develop into blockers down the road, but not him.
He really is basically a wideout. I mean, he’ll line up at tight end but expect him in the slot a lot like Keller.
Interesting. See I dont think so. I definitely look at him as a far third on my list and see the H-Back in him but he fights defenders off well and was good at blocking downfield. On top of that he’s a tough kid from Pitt. I think he has a much better chance of learning how to block than Beckum. That being said I’d MUCH rather have McCoy or Peek. I really love Peek’s blocking ability.
Uh, getting back to the Giants (I think ROC and Samard need to get a room, LOL), I’d love to see Reese come out of this draft with two of Rich’s “sleepers”: Callahan and Andrew Quarless.
I think both fit the Giants’ needs perfectly, and both might be available around the time in the draft when they become close to BPA.
I don’t see how Callahan doesn’t become a starting RT in the NFL. Guy is solid as a rock. I wanted to see Bulaga a few times this season and each time said to myself “Hey, their right tackle is pretty damn good too”. If you assume that by next season (if not this one) Beatty is able to beat out Diehl and force him back to LG, where he is fabulous, then the biggest needs for the Giants on the offensive line become finding successors to McKenzie and OHara, neither of whom are “done” at this point by any means. If Reese can nab Calloway he should be ready to step in at RT in two years, meanwhile allowing McKenzie to get some series off to protect his back. They can worry about a center in next year’s draft because no one’s replacing OHara for at least three more years. Centers, especially those as good as the one we’ve got, generally last a long time in the NFL, and it’s a tough position to learn since you also have to make all the assignment calls at the line-of-scrimmage.
I have really liked Quarless as potentially exactly what we need: a tight end in the Kevin Boss mold who can run patterns, catch the ball, and block and, while he isn’t All-World in any area is just a solid all-around player who wouldn’t hurt you if forced to play because of injury to Boss. Given the presence on the roster of others who are excellent blockers at TE who are not really threats in the passing game, and Beckum, who is not much of a blocker but a serious threat in the passing game either at TE or as an H-back (his more natural NFL position IMO), what we need is that classic back-up tight end who will work hard to get better every year until he isn’t far behind your starter. I think Quarless would be just that. I like him as a fifth pick if he’s around at that point.
I’m pretty impressed with the draft knowledge on this site… for the record.
I’ve seen JD Walton projected as high as the 2nd round. 2nd best OC prospect after Pouncey.
Matt Tennant says waddup…
Centers always slip a few rounds and Tennant will be off the board first.
“Twenty teams expected to attend today’s workout for Oklahoma St. WR Dez Bryant. Last week, Bryant clocked a 4.32 in the 40-yard dash.”
Per Adam Schefter
Krow re Coker @10:23am: “With a name like Coker you know Andy Reid is taking a hard look. In fact… adoption is a possibility.”
Your humor never disappoints.
That would save them a draft pick.
HopLax, glad you’re around. One last favor. My daughter is going down to Baltimore next week to take a look around Hopkins to decide whether she’s going to go to school there or at Columbia. She’d live in one of the “fun, and relatively safe” neighborhoods. If you were ordering them in rank order from most desirable to least how would you rank them (remember, she’s 27 and single)? She’ll only be there for two days so I’m hoping she won’t waste her time looking at areas that aren’t the best fit for her. Thanks for any help. What you already wrote here was very helpful.
Samardzija/Kujo-Very good rebut article. Apparently I’m wrong. Well done.
However, the surgery HAS greatly improved and I guess just hasn’t caught up to the NFL yet. I have a surgeon friend who sat down with me and had a long conversation about achilles surgery just a week or two ago. He was saying how surgeons are excited because an achilles injury use to mean you were pretty much messed up for life and usually had a limp for the remainder and now what they are doing is taking a tendon from cadavers’ knees (which from what he says are much stronger and would actually make your achilles stronger than original) and replacing the torn achilles. The recovery is probably about a year out. So I’m not saying that we shouldn’t replace AB, I’ve been outspoken about Ryan Mathews being one of my favorite talents in this draft (even over Spiller). But if guys like AB want to come back they should be able to now unlike yesteryear. I guess its a matter of if a guy wants it enough to go through the long rehab.
I am sorry I am so late on the Coughlin debate, but I just wanted to throw a few things out there.
1. His Military style, background, tactics, whatever you wanna call it, is a good thing for a football team. When you have people moving in separate directions, there is no way to compete (this did end up happening to him late in the season, but stay with me for a second)
2.I know we all think we know a lot about football… we think we know offensive plays, and defensive schemes… but what do we really know? Tom Coughlin has been playing, coaching, teaching this game for longer than most of us have been alive, and def longer than most of us have watched the game. I trust his judgment, as far as running a team.
3. A head coach is a few things, he is a figurehead, he is the face of the organization. He is the ring leader, he is the motivator. He is not a position coach, he has to work with the “team”. He organizes meetings, does press conferences, gets the guys to work on time, he is the organizer, the manager if you will. He delegates responsibilities and it is on his coaching staff to execute his demands. The position coaches and coordinators are support yes, but once they are given that responsibility they have to do something with it, you cant just look for TC to coach everyone all day long, he has to organize the team functions, meetings, conferences,draft discussion, you get what im saying.
4. TC has been able to take us to the playoffs, more than not during his tenure here. He has done it with, a mediocre at best ST unit (i know i preach ST all the time, but it is 1/3 of our team). He has done that in the toughest division in all of sports IMO. In a division that normally sends 3 of the 6 playoff representatives every year, TC has beaten the best competition within our division year after year, to get us in a position to make a run. (last year was an exception IMO) Could you imagine Wade Phillips, Jim Zorn, Andy Reid in NYC? They would never make it. TC has done it in both the HC and coordinator role.
5. TC’s football style is a direct correlation to the mentality of Giants football. RUN The ball, and PLAY DEFENSE! that is how the giants play football, and I wouldn’t want it any other way! And he is able to control this team in NYC, with all the distractions, and charges against athletes today, he has kept our team relatively (aside from one dumb-ass gloxico incident) tame.
6. I would like to go back to what Jfunk was saying abotu the coaches that are better…i can think of maybe 3 or 4 that i could possibly throw in there, but some just dont have proven track records to me, and most of the best coaches EVER have been with the Giants. As of now, Belicheck, Payton, and TC would be three of the best, and all three were giants coaches before getting started. We get great coaches, and I would put TC under that title.
7. And OMG whoever said what if we miss the playoffs or win the superbowl then he is gone? IF WE WIN THE SUPERBOWL HE IS GONE? Am i missing something, is there something else that we would like TC to do for us? I may be wrong but im pretty sure we want him to do one thing, and that is win us a freaking SUPERBOWL GIVE ME A BREAK!!!
8. and Last i promise, Injuries killed us this season. TC was coaching a team back-ups. This team just could not compete with a stacked (and i use that sarcastically) Carolina team. We just could not make the plays even when the guys were in position. It is hard to keep people going in the same direction, when none of them understand what that direction means, and where the final destination is, becuase they are not qulity ball players. They are scrubs. They were to be back-ups this season. How can you expect a coach to make adjustments when he has a team of scrubs on the field. as kujo said “playing next to Danny Clark, and in front of CC Brown, Michael Johnson and Aaron Rouse,” how can you expect to make in game changes and adjustments on the fly when these guys cant even play BASE defense. A base 4-3 we couldn’t stop anyone with the things we “knew” how to do, how do you except us to make in game changes?
Sorry about the length, I just think that TC is one of the better coaches int he league, and don’t think you guys understand what it takes to be a head coach. I coach football, and there is way more “organization” by the head coach than what is done on game day, and aside from a few games where the guys we put ont he field were nothign more than back-ups, I think TC has put the NY Giants on the field as prepared if not way more prepared than most coaches in the league.
One thing I’ve been wondering about. Assuming Taylor Mays slips into the second round (I know, Carroll might want him with his second pick in the first round, but I think the Seahawks have bigger needs elsewhere, and given the “risk” of selecting him I think most teams will shy away in order to get a “sure thing” with their first pick) what happens if the Seahawks pass on him with their third pick (in the second round)? Would he drop all the way to pick #46?
Let’s say the Giants come out of the first round with Haden, McClain or Weatherspoon (we can talk all we want to about Spiller…I don’t think he gets to #15 or even very close). They still need a defensive tackle and there will be some excellent ones available at #46 and some decent ones still available at #79. But if Phillips isn’t progressing on schedule by late April when the draft comes along, they also need a safety.
Should they do what they must to get Mays? Reese might be getting the steal of the decade if he gets him with a 2nd round pick. He also might be getting skunked if he gives up getting Alualu or Houston in order to get Mays. Of course, the ideal would be to figure out a way to be left with two 2nd rounders and come out of Friday with both a DT and a defensive back (I’m assuming that Best is also gone no later than very early 2nd round) while still having a great shot at Calloway or another OT in the next round.
But what would you do if you were looking at having a legit shot at Mays versus one of the 4-5 best defensive tackles?
Seahawks no longer pick in front of us in the 2nd round. They swapped places with San Diego in the Whitehurst trade. Makes him dropping marginally more likely…
Hmm, didn’t realize that. Okay, whose your pick? I’d have a really hard time passing up Mays in the 2nd round.
Grateful, I for one have been carefully watching football, and playing it at a relatively low level, for as long as has Coughlin. You are correct in saying that Coughlin is “good”, and you are correct in describing the Head Coach’s job as equivalent to a CEO’s in the business world. But that is far from the entire story.
Read all the comments about him and then you should recognize that many of us, me included, neither deny that he has some excellent qualities nor are willing to allow those qualities to obscure his many blind spots. Yes, he is probably the best coach in the NFC (despite being absolutely outcoached by Andy Reid of late because of Coughlin’s unwillingness to change his game plans…and they ARE his game plans, not that of his coordinators). Yes, he has kept the team competitive. And no, there aren’t a huge group of better alternatives out there. I have said that for a long time.
But those blind spots (loyalty above talent; inability to make game day adjustments; two horrendous hiring decisions during his tenure and then the decision to fire Waufle for unwillingness to toe the line when he believed his guys on the D-line were being unfairly blamed for failure when they were being misused by a bad coordinator; unwillingness to get enough snaps for younger players early in a season so they’d be ready if called upon later in that same season becaiuse of injuries; and some really horrible game plans in important games that were either Coughlin’s or had his full approval) have cost this team at least one good chance at a championship in 2008 and some playoff chances in 2005-2006 that were undermined by a combination of player performance and very mediocre coaching.
And there is always his retention of Tom Quinn, who continues to field poor special teams, a part of the team to which Coughlin claims to pay special attention. Waufle is fired, Quinn is retained. Lewis and Sheridan were hired over highly-qualified competition and both were only fired under directive from the Maras. Those are CEO-type decisions that, along with the above, convince me that the coach we have is not as good as one we could have. Not many here are claiming the guy is a bum. We all know he’s better than most current NFL coaches. That doesn’t mean we can’t do better.
I would LOVE Mays at 46 but still see no way in hell he drops that far..Especiall if KP isnt ready to roll.
I personally am tired of this Coughlin debate..Does he have his faults? Yes but he is no doubt in the upper echelon of Coaches in the NFL..For all of you anti Coughlin guys out there, I ask you to name 3 Coaches in the NFL that have had more sucess the last 5 years than he has. I get that we are all fustrated with the last 2 seasons, but 08 was Plax fault, not Coughlins and 09 was far more injury / Sheriden at fault than Coughlin..Reading all this anti Coughlin stuff reminds me of the knuckleheads in Philly that want Reid fired…
Amen Demo. and for him to do that in Today’s NFL, I would say he is staying on top of the game
…done with coughlin debate…
FF55 – busy day here. will respond to your Baltimore neighborhoods question when there is a lull or at worst later tonight when the us serfs man the M&A kingdom. I also heard back from my friend that took 4 classes at SPH this weekend. I will share his thoughts with you when I respond to you later.
ff, yeah i get that noone thinks hes the worst (one person did) and noone thinks hes the best (although, i dont think i can find anyone who i would put above him coaching today…obviously im a little biased but i just dont).
I just wanted to point out what a “good” coach he is, IMO.
Obviously we all have flaws, but he is a good coach. No coach in the NFL will ever be a Red Aurbach, or Wooden, its not possible in this league. But to have a coach who can consistently make good decisions for the well being of a team, IMO, is much more valuable than a coach who can take you there this year, and then takes three years to get back…
OMG i completely agree with you about ST and freaking Quinn, i have been right there with you the whoel time, and my point was that even with a shotty ST unit for 6 year (however it should have been revised at some point), that is 1/3 of our team, we get beaten on ST every game, and we still make the playoffs year in and year out.
Is Bradford really gonna be the #1 pick?
Yup. Pretty much a lock now. Blew scouts away yesterday while throwing to his college teammate receivers without pads and no defense.
Alex Smith did the same thing.
thanks, come on Bradford, Clausen and Tebow…please, please please get taken before #15… let the class of the draft fall to us! pretty please!
For some reason, I just cant see spags passing on those three defenders. Is bolger still on their team? and then AJ Feely? I would stick with Bolger for Suh, MccCoy, or Berry. Am I wrong? I just don’t see Bradford as that strong of a QB in the NFL…
Despite his defensive background, it’s certainly possible that Spagnuolo is a believer in the “franchise QB” theory.
His NFL experience consists of Redskins (Theismann), Eagles (McNabb), and Giants (Manning), so he’s personal experience has always been on a team with a true leader at the position.
I don’t claim to know his thinking, but just saying that it’s certainly a possibility that with that background he fully believes in the concept that when you have a chance to get a QB, you take it no matter what the cost.
Samarg
I live abuot five miles from Hampton U. The young man LaMarcus Coker
is said to have run a 4.22 , 4.27 and 4.26 40’s All of them in front of pro scouts at various pro days and bowl games. So there is no BS going on there. You did some digging for that one. Hat’s off to you bud.
He came from Tennessee where he had the starting job in 2006. He got poped for drugs. He really cost himself a position in the draft. He has first day talent (IMO).
They let him go, and he showed up here. I can tell you first hand he’s had not problems playing here. Perhaps he got the message. All that aside, he just about rules the MEAC. Excellent talent we are talking a Spiller type guy here.
Wtf, a guy who works 18 hours a day doesn’t do anything but oversee and delegate? A guy with a staff of 100 at most has as many varying things going on as a CEO, such a finance, operations, human resources?
He’s a damn football coach. And an average one at that. You contend that he oversees gameplans and its the coordinator’s job ultimately. What, he just reads them and gives no feedback? All those years of wisdom, none shared?
The other part of the argument is “who is better, I can only name 3″, and you go on to name Payton. Weird, he’s only been a head coach for a few years, I wonder if there’s any other coordinators who could make the jump like him.
I insist that Coughlin has been given a good to great roster and has been middle of the road with it. Won his division twice in 6 years, just like the other two teams in the division. Won a championship with lightning in the bottle, to which he deserves some credit.
But to absolve him for 2006, 2008 and 2009 while crediting him for 2007 is a biased joke of an argument.
Middle of the road.
Since when is winning your division twice and winning the Superbowl once in 6 years “middle of the road”?
Again I challenge, who are these coaches that fill this hypothetical road of yours to either side of Coughlin in the middle?
JFunk- dont waste your breath on Dirt bro..He has it all figured out with his TC with Spag and TC without Spags thing..The Bottom line is there arent 3 Coaches in the NFL that have done more than TC in the last 5 years. That is a fact. Arguing over Roster talent and whos at fault for this or that is ALL OPINION.. The Bottom line is TC has won a SB, a Conf Title, 2 Division titles, has gone to the playoffs 4 times in 5 years and has won 53 games (including Postseason). But by all means he meust suck and should be fired so we can replace him with the next hot young candidate that could be the next Sean Payton, or maybe the next Rod Marinelli, Jim Zorn, Raheem Morris or Cam Cameron,
Thank you, how are all the rest of the coaches inteh NFL lookin… expecially to Win the NFC East… God if we were in the NFC west, and didnt win 2 division titles i would cry… wonder if thats happened? i mean we play in the BEST DIVISION IN ALL OF SPORTS. The NFC East. We dont play the seahawks twice, we dont play the browns and bemngals twice. we dont play the raiders, cheifs and broncos twice. We play real live football.
*especially
Eli Manning’s favorite curse word: “Darnit”
http://www.maxim.com/sports/articles/89522/nfl-players-give-us-their-favorite-swear-words.html
LOL…thats classic
also, i like how KD, while his overall posting volume is down, has refined his posting game to invariably hilarious links
kudos
I thought Chris Johnson had the best answer. Explaining how he uses the curse words in game situations…”Why you gotta push my face in the dirt you motherf–king b!tch?”
hahaha i was confused about that because then he looked in the camera and said it again along with “you know who im talkin bout B!tch”
i was like, wait….is he serious right now?
and it think that was cribbs, not CJ. i remember cuz i was surprised at how high his voice was…
Dirt,
let me rephrase this …
“3. A head coach is a few things, he is a figurehead, he is the face of the organization. He is the ring leader, he is the motivator. He is not a position coach, he has to work with the “team”. He organizes meetings, does press conferences, gets the guys to work on time, he is the organizer, the manager if you will. He delegates responsibilities and it is on his coaching staff to execute his demands. The position coaches and coordinators are support yes, but once they are given that responsibility they have to do something with it, you cant just look for TC to coach everyone all day long, he has to organize the team functions, meetings, conferences,draft discussion, you get what im saying.”
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
a HEAD COACH (is obviously a football head coach, i thought that calling him a HEAD coach would get my point across that he is a head football coach, a head coach of a football team) as well as a few things…
My point is that it is not he, who teaches Eli a 5 step drop, it is not he who explains to Osi, that you have outside contain, and its not he who teaches laurence tynes how kick an extra point. I “contend” that it is he who devises a gameplan, and explains to each coach what their “players” responsibiliteis are. There is no way he could go over all 53 guys responsibilities…its not possible. Especially when half of a team plays offense and the other half plays defense, how can TC go from person to person and i believed I used the word manager, not CEO. I also “contend” that he definitely made a few personel mistakes, and was forced to face the music.
The three coaches I picked out were Giants coaches that have won super bowls in the last 6 years…Put into that Tomlin and Dungy, and I would take Coughlin personally. He runs My kind of football. Giants football play defense and run the ball. Can you us one? two?
I am not absolving he or any of the giants for 2006, 08, and 09. I just want to know where your “better 2 or three” coaches were during those season that TC was taking us to the playoffs.
Wasn’t picking you out in particular, but since you’ve served it up…
I’m glad that your kind of football has been defined by having your team quit on a third of your seasons, one magical run, and severely ouclassed by your opponent in the playoffs in the other seasons.
sorry though you were.
My team quit on me one time, this past season when they were all on the bench with injuries.
One magical run to a Superbowl in 5 years is def my kind of football. no one wins championships after championships in the NFL it doesn’t happen. The only team that outclassed us in the playoffs other than the Eagles (who we play twice a year every year and i admit there was a plethora of horrible game plans ) was carolina, coached by OUR former DC obviously he knew a thing or two about us.
*thought*
ESPN.com’s Matt Mosley just said in his weekly NFC East Chat that he guarantees the Giants will select a linebacker with the #15 pick.
I believe they will if McClain is there. I hope that if Spoon is the pick that they trade down 5-8 picks..I just think there is too much talent at the top to pick him at 15
hahaha, well Mosley – who I usually like – seems to think “That kid from Florida” is an option at 15 a little later on in the chat.
So it looks like he has not been paying that much attention. Spikes is a 4th rounder at best now.
Wow.
I say explicitly middle of the road and some think that means terrible. No, it means middle of the road.
Wisenhunt, Tomlin, Childress, Reid, Phillips, Belichick, Dungy, Turner, Payton and Harbaugh have all enjoyed similar success as Coughlin as of late, to name a few. Time will certainly tell the story with some of the new arrivals, and even some of the other young coaches, like Ryan and Sparano.
But to state so vehemently that Coughlin is better than but three coaches is ridiculous.
Where are you turkeys to argue at night!?
yeah, middle of the road sounds about right to me…hes definitely not “elite”
to be honest, i was hoping that the crash-and-burn of last season was gonna be enough to get him canned and get cowher in here.
still, i think the funny part of this whole argument is that, even if we win the super bowl next year, coughlins gone. i think the FO realizes that they have cowher waiting in the wings and hes gonna wanna come back the year after next…
if we are anything short of a SB, the FO will say its time to go, but i think that even if we win, they’ll try to push TC out on the idea of “going out on top”
imho
Ugh…I hate Brad Childress. Favre saved his job.
But who has done better than us in that time?
the steelers they play the browns and bengals twice a year?? How could they not win htat division? if they miss the playoffs oh wait they did too…
the colts, won more games, but they continue to fail in the playoffs. and they play in a garbage division.
Ken wisenhunt? NFC west
Childress has had 2 good seasons??? plays the Lions twice a year
Ried, Phillips, come to NY with your issues, you wouldnt make it one week let alone through a whole season. Ried is a great coach, adn I would put his up there, but he just couldnt do what he does in ny with the distractions.
dungy… hes playin golf,
harbaugh, id put him in the Ryan sparano category. I just dont see anyone that much better. Give the giants 2 free wins a year, or 4 free wins a year… well NEVER miss the playoffs.
You can say we play the skins every year, but they have a real live defense, and they build their team every year to beat US, philly and dallas and they cant…
i dont think its that ridiculous…
In the interest of the writers hard work on drafts stuff, ill cease all further comment about our average to above average head coach, until the next applicable article.
Carry on with the draft talk, fellas.
deal!
I’d trust Mosely on Cowboys stuff, as he has connections in Dallas, but he’s just another guy regarding the Giants. His word is no more reliable than any other sportswriter.
If MG made that claim, I would listen closer.
Maybe the most important sports story of the day: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/03/30/new-hgh-test-emerges/.
If that test is legit, and they lined up players today and administered it, I bet there would be ALOT of positive tests.
Per Pat Traina’s Twitter, according to McClain on Sirius, he just wrapped up his Miami pre-draft visit. Still has to visit Atlanta, Jacksonville…and will be in NY on April 12th.
I want either Tennant or Walton. Walton can play guard as well, so hes a bit more valuable as depth, but I think Tennant will be the better center.
Krow- Yeah the draft knowledge here rivals any site
Wow, this is an interesting draft rumor – according to the SF Chronicle –
The Raiders have been offered a second rounder in this years draft and a 2011 first rounder for the #8 overall pick.
Someone is trying to leapfrog Buffalo at #9 it seems. (QB? OT?)
As of right now, the Raiders do not own a 2011 first rounder, it belongs to the Pats.
You know, TC does have a beef attached to his run as NYG head coach.
I mean Roy Lee Howell had Landry and Lombardi as DC/OC respectively.
I wonder just how hard ole Roy had to work during those day’s?
Point is, Spags was the way to go, and it’s most likely JR, or Mr. Mara’s fault he got away. Guy was special and I think they all knew it.
And I would include TC in that group too.
As for criticism of TC? He sometimes goes overboard with the military example setting.
He has the core of player treatment right. But I think his sticking with older pro’s over youth can be a positive, but only if the old pro is playing at a high level. He is very orginized, and his team will know the game plan. It just that now, the game plans for offense and last years defense, did not and will not feed the bulldog. And some here are right, its not on TC to create the game plans. But surely he’s been around long enough, to iron them out if they dont match what he thinks will work. Surely he understands when neither offense or defense adjust to advers conditions.
Youngsters should learn before they are simply “given” starting jobs.
The young ones dont get anything free from TC. And thats not all bad. The only way a young player will play under TC is first: Injury and lack of veteran backup. Second: The kid is so good he just cant be kept on the bench. Again a military example.
Sintim however, should have been playing from day on last year.
I know he was hurt, but he should have been allowed to play.
He was/is a better blitzer/pass rusher than Clark has or ever will be.
Bruce Johnson played because of injury and lack of depth.
Bradshaw, Boss and Smith all played in 07 because of their talent.
Now with a number 15 pick, and (you pick’em) defensive holes to fill, TC will no doubt have to play a rookie this year. In fact, he may have to play two or three depending on how well Jacobs, Brown, Bradshaw and Alford respond to their operations.
All in all, TC did some very good things. He’s brought discipline and accountability to what had become a bunch of no loads. So sometimes, you should deal with the devil you know vice importing one who you dont.
One other thing about the military approach, I remember some of the kids who worked for me saying that they hated me so much, that they were happy to work with their team mates in order to avoid doing it my shall we say corrections.
That included white kids working with black kids and so on and so forth.
They told me this when I would take them out for a beer after work on Friday nights. I started that after having them for about a year.
You see, that’s what you want them to do. Even if they do something wrong, you want them to work it out within the group and (most times) according to the rules.
They learn to depend on and respect each other. And those who come in and dont conform to standards? I never had to say a word. I had all the enforcers I would ever need in that nucleus of kids.
But its a very lonley and mis-understood path you have to take.
I dont doubt that TC has felt very alone at times both here and in JAX.
But at some point, you have to ease up, and have a few conversations that aren’t always one way. People are not machines, and you have to understand that.
Dealing with young millionaires is an entirely different job order. All but a very few know anything about depending on stranger for your very existance. And you know what, most 18 to 20 year old kids really should not have to. Thank God we have some young people that do. I am not mad at those who dont. Because it takes a special person. Just like it takes special ball players to become a top notch unit. Both physically and mentaly that is.
This team does need fresh blood at the head coaching slot.
Because so few people can stike a balance between boss and confidant.
Being one makes it almost impossiable to be the other. My way or the highway works in the military, because lives are at stake.
Remember the over used Team Chemistry terminalogy? So much is made of how it’s just a bunch of BS.
Well, do your homework and you will find out, that those teams who do manage to bond, do manage to win.
There are exceptions. But not many. (75 Oakland A’s) ???
A 1 and a 2 is steep…
Actually 2 #1s
It sounds like it would be a #2 this year and a #1 in 2011 in the rumored deal above. The Raiders would have no #1’s and 2 #2’s this year and would be back in the 2011 first round.
I would love to hear who is trying to make this move so I could figure out who they are targeting.
Could be total BS at this point.
Of course if the Raiders are going to trade for McNabb, they better get some offensive linemen in there too. Their tackles were terrible last season.
If Philly sends McNugget to the Raiders, they are writting off the year, and stocking up on draft choices. If this happens, they will be hell to deal with next year, and the latter part of this one. The birds know how to select defensive and skill players.
The Giants will most likely not move at all except for down. That is very conservative, makes some sense. However, its about as exciting as watching grass grow.
Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Thats conservative saying.
Amazing how many conservatives are into stocks and bonds.
I do not think they would be writing off 2010.
They clearly think Kolb is the man for the job and want to dump McNabb now while they can get value for him. Makes sense to me.
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